SUBSCRIBE NOW WELCOME BACK. Do you want to continue reading where you left off? New Republic subscribers can pick up where they left off no matter which device they were previously using. SUBSCRIBE NOW

Go Home Is Henry Wallace On The New Republic Staff Again?

THE SPINE AUGUST 12, 2008

Is Henry Wallace On The New Republic Staff Again?

BY MARTIN PERETZ

John Judis has often had a soft spot for America's enemies.  Here he goes
again.

1) He lists "the U.S. And Cuba" alongside "Germany
and Belgium" and "Iraq and Kuwait" in a list of interstate relationships that
exemplify "the old story of large countries attempting to subjugate small
ones." Right, because America's anti-Castro policy of the last 50 years is in
any way morally comparable to the Kaiser ransacking Belgium (I can't
believe that even he would compare us to the Nazis) or Saddam Hussein
annexing Kuwait as Iraq's 19th province.

 

2) He writes that "the
takeover of Czechoslovakia after World War II (as opposed to the takeover of,
say, Lithuania earlier) was not an inevitable outgrowth of Soviet foreign
policy."

 

There is nothing less than Henry Wallace, doughface tripe.

Update: Judis' item
obviously upset me. And I have had my differences with John over the years. (As
you know, I revel in intellectual give-and-take) But re-reading this item a few
hours later, I realize that my rhetoric was a bit too rough. Since our
disagreements are fierce, I wish my language had been less angry.

SHARE YOUR THOUGHTS

Show all 20 comments

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

20 comments

Don't you think Judis was thinking of the Kaiser's "rape of Belgium" during World War I? I highly doubt that Judis was comparing America to the Nazis. And, by the way, there is a long history of America thinking of Cuba as a potential American state that belonged (at the very least) under American hegemony. Many, many people described Cuba as "low-hanging fruit" ready to be gobbled up in America's Empire of Liberty throughout the 19th Century, and the Platt Amendment basically made Cuba an extension of the US for many years.

Equating Judis with Wallace is red-baiting. Knock it off.

- propositionjoe

August 12, 2008 at 12:05pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

Or was Judis referring to pre-Castro Cuba? Either way, the two examples don't equate.

- JEFF FREY

August 12, 2008 at 12:05pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

Hey Marty, you hired him. And it is good that you did. I disagree with Judis a lot (about Obama, about this crisis, etc.) but find him a necessary counterweight at TNR. He is a fine writer as well.

- blackton

August 12, 2008 at 12:14pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

I hope Judis will respond to this blog attack.

- jacksondyer

August 12, 2008 at 12:43pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

god god...

A healthy exchange of opposing ideas is good for any magazine but this is typical chicken shit smear and insinuation from the master of chicken shit smear and insinuation.

You really are a foul piece of work. How you got to be your age with all your teeth is truly amazing...

- thejauntyboulevardier

August 12, 2008 at 12:57pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

p-joe, I think Marty's logic runs like this:

1.  Germany sought to dominate Belgium.

2.  American policy with respect to Cuba is not on the same moral level as the Kaiser's policy with respect to Belgium.

3.  Therefore, the U.S. did not seek to dominate Cuba.  Any implication to the contrary is moral relativism of the worst sort.

Marty is as much a stranger to logic as he is to the clear and concise use of the English language.

What was I thinking?  Reminder to self:  never click on the Spine.  Never click on the Spine.  Never click on the Spine...

- agentzero

August 12, 2008 at 1:00pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

Rough words? Oh dear. Poor Judis.

Far better that TNR's heavyweights start debating real issues-- with strong arguments strongly made-- than TNR continue wallowing in snarky little YouTube riffs about McCain's age or Obama's infinite coolness.

A debate among Wieseltier, Judis, Marty (and more to come, one hopes-- Applebaum, Joffe and McFaul?): hallelujah! TNR's back in action.

In all seriousness, it's nice to see the old TNR again. More like this, pls.

- teplukhin2you

August 12, 2008 at 1:30pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

Peretz, I don't like you and I think you really are a bastard.

However, on this one you're right. Judis is indeed Henry Wallace. But it's your fault.

Why is this The Nation-style fellow here? Who hired him if not yourself? You yourself are not very far from The Nation when it comes to supporting hard-core anti-Semites like Maureen Dowd.

So why are you surprised you have a Chomskyite here?   It's your responsibility. No one else's.

- sleepyavl

August 12, 2008 at 1:37pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

In defense of both Judis and Marty, the fact that Marty can dish and Judis can take, and keep posting/publishing in Marty's magazine,  suggests to me that a) they're friends and b) they're grownups, and c) this spirited discussion has probably been going on for the last 30 years. cf Marty vs Rick Hertzberg in the '80s, the Radosh/Rosenberg Files debates etc.

It's this intelligent and rough blue-on-blue debate that has made TNR the liveliest magazine on the political spectrum. It's precisely what makes TNR stand out from all the blog chatter and noise, and what's been so painfully missing from the bloggerish new tnr.com in recent months. The more TNR reverts to its old form-- grownups like JJ, LW, MP discussing grownup issues without reducing everything to Le Grand Satan in the White House-- the better for all of us. Carry on, gents.

- teplukhin2you

August 12, 2008 at 1:42pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

"A debate among Wieseltier, Judis, Marty (and more to come, one hopes-- Applebaum, Joffe and McFaul?): hallelujah! TNR's back in action."

My sentiments exactly.

John Judis the ball is in your court.

- jacksondyer

August 12, 2008 at 2:03pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

humm...tep, there might be somethinig to what you say but if the "lively" disourse that so enamours you is coming from the top of the organizational hierarchy downward, then it makes the "liveliness' more complicated.

Now, Judis is a mature journalist and perhaps he feels secure enough to tangle with the top brass of tnr, and if that is the case, bully for him.

We must however, allow for the possibility that a lower level editor, getting called out like this by the Editor in Chief and his compadre, may feel somewhat constrained in the parameters of his response. The Grudge Holder calls him Henry Wallace...can Judis call him Westbrook Pegler in return and be okay?  

You boys are far too civilized for me. I grew up in a different environment, a place where if some guy smeared you and attributed dark and insulting intentions to your words and actions, then well, now, hey, there, that guy better be able to "take it" in more than just one way...

I am glad that I do not live or operate in this "civilzed" environment that seems to be so alluring to you and others. Some bullet headed intellectual bully cracks wise with the guys I grew up with, he better be more than just a smart aleck wise guy.  Makes things less complicated...

- thejauntyboulevardier

August 12, 2008 at 3:02pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

True, jaunty, us geeks tear each other apart with words, not shivs. But it's nothing personal, at least not with me or, I suspect, Judis. Sort of like that old WB cartoon that showed the wolf and the sheepdog clocking in to "work", beating the stuffing out of each other, and ending each episode by clocking out and saying, "'night, Ralph." "'night, Louie."

- teplukhin2you

August 12, 2008 at 3:21pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

"Right, because America's anti-Castro policy of the last 50 years is in any way morally comparable to the Kaiser ransacking Belgium (I can't believe that even he would compare us to the Nazis) or Saddam Hussein annexing Kuwait as Iraq's 19th province.?"

Let''s see: we sponsored one invasion of the country, blockaded them to prevent them from making a voluntary military alliance,during which time we regularly invaded their airspace, maintain a military presence on their island against their manifest will based on colonial era accomodiationist treaty, and have economically embargoed them for 50 years, at obvious cost to their economy.

So, no, not comparable to driving the German imperial army through Belgium in 1914, but as an example of a large country thinking it has the right subjugate or dominate a smaller one, not a bad example either.  

Methinks Peretz overly sensitive about "moral" equivalents here.  A great nation can take criticism of its policy where deserved, admit fault, and is all the stronger to criticize others when it does so.

- sdemuth

August 12, 2008 at 3:27pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

tep...

great, great image. Yes, I do remember that cartoon...wayward youth obviously

- thejauntyboulevardier

August 12, 2008 at 3:34pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

jaunty - I grew up in that environment as well, and I can say without reservation that I am very pleased to have left it.  If civilization means arguing with words rather than bullets (truth be told, when I was in the DCPS it was mostly knives), then the world could use a great deal more of it.

Also, three cheers for that classy postscript from Marty.

- ratnerstar

August 12, 2008 at 4:24pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

Great post muth; well put.

- The Ignorant Populist

August 12, 2008 at 4:30pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

ratty...

vive le differance!  I am glad I left the environment too but I value the no nonsense rules - minus lethal weapontry of course, even I wouldn't want to shiv or sap The Grudge Holder - especially when dealing with wise ass intellectual provocateurs who forget their physical limitations...

- thejauntyboulevardier

August 12, 2008 at 4:58pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

Great cartoon reference Tep.  I am going to go out on a proverbial limb and suggest that Marty's rhetorical style draws from the the Jewish Talmudic tradition which is to debate points hard a fiercely (the image used is shooting arrows at each other), but then to end the debate as friends.

Even in the Talmud we didn't always pull it off and arguments veered from principle to personal, but that's the ideal that is aspired to.  Sadly, today some debaters have become twisted parodies of this Talmudic paradigm, but I think Marty lives up to the erudite and principled partner in Debate for the Sake of Heaven willing to stake a position and see who attacks it.  We all grow thereby from the dialectic.

Yishar Koach to all willing to jump in the fray with intellectual honesty and still remain friends.

- Gavriel Meir-Levi

August 12, 2008 at 5:24pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

Exactly. That's the spirit of the old, pre-bloggerish TNR. Nice to see its return.

- teplukhin2you

August 12, 2008 at 6:14pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

Thanks Marty for pointing out the 'Moral Equivalence' failure of the Judis piece.

America's relationship with Cuba can not be compared in any way to Iraq/Kuwait or Germany/Belgium.  It just stuns me how writers will not criticize Cuba, even as Fidel passes power to Raul and confirms the worst about Cuban Leadership.

Another point in Judis peice is his reference to the League of Nations to give it some historical gravity.  America was never a member of the LoN, and Germany was basically screwed over by the LoN, and there short 7 years in the League were over 7 years before they invaded Belgium.  LoN predates Iraq & Kuwait.

The USSR joined in 1934 and was expelled in 1939.  (Hmm... 1939)  Russia and Poland would probably have been a better 3rd for his analogy that US/Cuba, unless you believe as President Ford did that Poland was not under Soviet Domination.  Remember were talking about Russia/Georgia here.

Using the League of Nations in his piece points to another attempt to create Gravitas in the absence of relevance.  Similar to the US/Cuba reference.

A more telling take would be an attempt to look at the LoN faiolures, along with the UN failures to see why Russia and Georgia failed to resolve this dispute in the General Assembly.

- CRS9TNR

August 12, 2008 at 9:38pm

You must be a subscriber to post comments. Subscribe today.

SHARE HIGHLIGHT

0 CHARACTERS SELECTED

TWEET THIS

POST TO TUMBLR

SHARE ON FACEBOOK

Close