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Go Home Let Them Live In Chappaqua!

THE SPINE MAY 7, 2008

Let Them Live In Chappaqua!

BY MARTIN PERETZ

It was not only Hillary Clinton who lost big-time in North Carolina.
It was also Bill Clinton who spent an uninterrupted week in the state
campaigning so that the two might once again inhabit the White House.
Don't they understand that the people do not want them. Let them live
in Chappaqua or Little Rock or even apart. But not at 1600
Pennsylvania Avenue.

 

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69 comments

Marty's menstruating...

- nturner

May 7, 2008 at 12:53am

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"Let them live in Chappaqua or Little Rock or even apart."

You are ruthless.

- rozenson

May 7, 2008 at 1:02am

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50 bucks says that after this Hillary divorces Bill and comes out of the closet. Probably moves in to a Manhattan penthouse with her personal assistant and lives an openly gay lifestyle.  Finally, after all her dreams of conquest have turned to dust, finally she can be herself. Losing this election will probably be the best thing that's ever happened to Hillary. :-)

- AaronBBrown

May 7, 2008 at 1:11am

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read andrew sullivan's blog about the black vote and how it did the Clintons in. Their cynicism and willingness to abandon principle to get votes came back to bite them in the butt. They got their just desserts (hmmm . . . can I find more colloquialisms to make this point?)

- scire

May 7, 2008 at 1:24am

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oops, here's the link to the blog:

andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish

- scire

May 7, 2008 at 1:26am

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AaronBBrown:

50 bucks you are an idiot.

- sleepyavl

May 7, 2008 at 2:05am

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sleepyavl:

.?? ????? ?? ??? ??? ?????? ?????

- rozenson

May 7, 2008 at 4:16am

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rozenson:

Sound advice!, thank you. I should remember it more often.

- sleepyavl

May 7, 2008 at 5:23am

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Rozenson, could you please translate? AaronBBrown is a blight on these blogs. It is not his opinions, it is his tone and, occasionally, his obscenties.

- liberal reformer

May 7, 2008 at 5:42am

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LR - not to mention the sexism. He does Obama supporters no good with this crap.

- Wandreycer1

May 7, 2008 at 6:24am

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?? ????? ?? ??? ??? ?????? ?????

Rozenson, transliterated: Al te-bizbez at hakoach shelcha bedvarim ktanim.

Literally: Don’t waste your strength on small things.

i. e.: Don’t bother with small minds.

Sleepy, never ind Aaron B Brown.   I hope she stays in the race, at least, till the last primary in June.

- jacksondyer

May 7, 2008 at 7:13am

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It's been a long time since Hebrew school and my time in the desert, and I think the fourth word is misspelled, but I believe the proper translation is,

"Don't waste your energy on things that liars say."

?? ????? ?? ??? ??? ?????? ?????

FYI, when you see a little :-) after my statement, it means I'm fucking with y'all. Obviously it had the desired effect.  And by the way it's against site rules to post comments in languages other than English.

PS  Kiss my ass you small minded humorless losers.  :-)

PPS  Real Jews have a sense of humor.

- AaronBBrown

May 7, 2008 at 7:46am

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Real Jews are actually funny!

- Wandreycer1

May 7, 2008 at 9:26am

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Whether one spells ??? with or without a vav the sentence doesn’t mean.

"Don't waste your energy on things that liars say."

You do a lot of projecting Aaron.

“PS  Kiss my ass you small minded humorless losers.”

Every fucking punk around here thinks he has a sense of humor.

“PPS  Real Jews have a sense of humor.”

Yea, Jewish humor, which is witty and ironic and something completely alien to you!

Next time you pen an attack on Hillary try something original less like those of an  hebetudinous eunuch.

- jacksondyer

May 7, 2008 at 9:50am

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Obama won NC, Limbaugh won IN. That sliver of a margin, 23,000 votes, easily represents that very strange group of Republicans who delight in voting for someone they hate.

Begala and Carville are now everywhere, tucking their shirts in as they talk, making like the Dukes of Hazard...I'm starting to miss Mark Penn.

- fougasseu

May 7, 2008 at 10:10am

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Imagine that you're a Cossack who after a long day of raping and pillaging, come home to your tortured thoughts. Or you're Willie Sutton, the Man Who Knew Where They Kept the Money, and as you sit in your cell, you have bad dreams of the pennies and nickels you stole from kids and old ladies. Or you're Professor Moriarity, of Napoleonic Criminal Hegemony, head oscillating and wondering what your mother would think of your wasted mathematical genius.

Each of these three bad guys can come home, turn on the laptop, go to the Spine and see for themselves that even though they may be worthless, criminal scum, there is a specie named peretz who, over the course of the past two days and even if the thrill of victory still has to make rude insinuations about Hillary Clinton's eating habits and her marriage, while dancing - if that spastic, ill coordinated locomotion of his can be called "dancing" - on her political grave.

So, rest easy oh weary Cossack, Willie Sutton, and Napoleon of Crime: You are bad yes but there does exist a germ named peretz who comparatively speaking, makes you three seem like warm hearted choir boys.

- thejauntyboulevardier

May 7, 2008 at 10:30am

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"Obama won NC, Limbaugh won IN. That sliver of a margin, 23,000 votes, easily represents that very strange group of Republicans who delight in voting for someone they hate."

How do you know that an even greater number of Republicans voted for Obama?

After the Republican are wildly jubilant that Obama will be candidate since they think he can be defeated a lot more easily than Hillary can.

Do you really think, fougasseu, that the kinds of people who voted for Obama in North Carolina, liberal yuppies and African Americans, will be able to carry their candidate into the White House?

- jacksondyer

May 7, 2008 at 10:34am

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Jacksondyer: Thanks much for the transliteration (I obviously don't know Hebrew). How juvenile, AaronBBrown is thrilled that he is having an effect on fellow bloggers by being juvenile.

- liberal reformer

May 7, 2008 at 10:45am

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Jackson:

Yes.

Obama can beat McBush. McBush will be put in an untenable position, endlessly distancing himself from an onslaught of racially-tinged attack ads that he won't be able to control, yet having to attack Obama himself, trying to frame him as less of a man than he is. How do you think that's going to go over with moderates and independents? McBush is in a very tough spot - even before you get to his worthless ideas on how to fix the economy. The only thing that will save him will be a series of orange alerts. Remember Rove's carefully timed orange alerts?

- fougasseu

May 7, 2008 at 10:46am

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Come on Cookie, Chappaqua is a great place. Honestly, what is so bad about being a Senator married to a former Pres. and being a multi-millionairess as well. Why do I need to weep for her? And people take this way too seriously, I mean it isn't Yankees-Red Sox. If I really wanted to curse Hillary I would say let her root for the Sox and live in beantown. Not even I am that cruel.

- blackton

May 7, 2008 at 10:58am

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fougasseu, when was the last time a Democrat won North or South Carolina?

I know you like the sound of McBush. But that is the problem. Do you think voters who don't vote in Democratic primaries would react to McBush the way you do?

I also see that you have left yourself a way out:

"The only thing that will save him will be a series of orange alerts. Remember Rove's carefully timed orange alerts?"

I can think of other scenarios that would work in McCain's favor. I worry that Obamites like yourself can't.

- jacksondyer

May 7, 2008 at 11:08am

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"If I really wanted to curse Hillary I would say let her root for the Sox and live in beantown. Not even I am that cruel."

And what is wrong with Bean Town? The baked beans are delicious and so is the clam chowder.

Try and find a great (or even adequate) bowl of clam chowder in Chappaqua?

Only Maine has better clam chowder.

- jacksondyer

May 7, 2008 at 11:10am

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jackson, I will give you New England clam chowder over Manhatten, but that is about as gracious as I go. My brother lives in Palmer, Mass. and I can't believe how much colder it is there than (when I used to live) Jersey.

- blackton

May 7, 2008 at 12:20pm

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Watch it Blackie, I'm from Boston, and I don't people dissing my hometown.  I will hunt you down if you try that again.  (Just joking, in case anyone thinks I'd actually stalk Blackie.)

Fougasseu:  It' not just the McBush stuff.  It's the fact that McCain just seems so out of it.  He keeps "mispeaking." (Sunnis, Shiites--they're all the same).  He's hunched over and looking every bit the old man that he is.  Once the we get past this ridiculous primary, the lights will once again be trained on McCain, and all that stuff like "cunt"-gate (sure, he's mellowed, sure) and "don't know much about the economy" and then Hagee (a wonderful Catholic/gay basher if ever there was) will fly back and drop a giant turd on his Johnny boy's.  On national TV.   Woo-hoo, can't wait.  This is going to be fun.  Even more fun when he picks a religious nut as his running mate and the guy's pastor gets scrutinized for all his talk about Jews going to Israel so Christ can come back and everybody goes into rapture.  McCain's toast, baby.  

- MOLLYSIMON

May 7, 2008 at 12:20pm

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Talking about McBush means that you don't have good enough arguments against McCain. It sounds like Nader voters circa 2000 saying that Al Gore and George Bush were the same. Same level of penetrating analysis.

- sleepyavl

May 7, 2008 at 12:27pm

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"blackton said: "jackson, I will give you New England clam chowder over Manhatten, but that is about as gracious as I go. My brother lives in Palmer, Mass. and I can't believe how much colder it is there than (when I used to live) Jersey."

Some of us like it cold. If I liked hot weather I would be living in Jaffa or Ashkelon, Israel.

- jacksondyer

May 7, 2008 at 12:37pm

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Molly

"Even more fun when he picks a religious nut as his running mate and the guy's pastor gets scrutinized for all his talk about Jews going to Israel so Christ can come back and everybody goes into rapture."

Fine reasoning indeed. Can't wait to see Jimmy Carter, Zbigniew Brzezinski, Noam Chomsky and Samantha Power in the Obama administration. Israel will be in great shape with these guys around!

- sleepyavl

May 7, 2008 at 12:47pm

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sleepy, I like McCain, but his only shot is to run as a Conservative Democrat. Promising to continue the Bush legacy (tax cuts, Iraq war) is a sure loser, he has to support the war but that will be his only conservative agenda.

- blackton

May 7, 2008 at 12:57pm

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"I like McCain, but his only shot is to run as a Conservative Democrat. Promising to continue the Bush legacy (tax cuts, Iraq war) is a sure loser, he has to support the war but that will be his only conservative agenda."

Blackton, if he runs as a "conservative Democrat"  and if the Demcrats nominate Obama I will vote for him.

It will be difficult as I never voted for a Republican in my life, but I can't see myself voting for the inexperienced and weak willed Obama.

On the other hand, if McCain chooses someone like Mitt Romney as his running mate, then I’ll just not vote for anyone in the Presidential contest this time.

- jacksondyer

May 7, 2008 at 1:14pm

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blackton, I don't particularly like McCain, but I worry about Obama and even more about his supporters. Right now this smells awfully bad of cult of personality cult and dictatorship.

Hilary has just been beaten. Instead of rejoicing, Obama's supportes want her to apologize! What does this have to do with demiocracy and with the right to show your ideas and run for office? It's all fair to want him to win. But there's nothing fair in trying to compel the other candidate to quit! Oh yeah, for the good of the country let's ignore some voters.

- sleepyavl

May 7, 2008 at 1:16pm

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My guess is tthat Obama, if he is the nominee, will have a relatively easier time beating him in the general, than he has had in beating Clinton in the primaries.

- thejauntyboulevardier

May 7, 2008 at 1:23pm

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I suspect Blackie is right.  McCain will run as the anti-Bush, no matter how closely the Dems try to tie them together.  Hell, he won't even use the word Republican much.

As we go along, the GOP base will not cozy up to McCain.  But they'll take a good hard look at BHO and the blood will run from their faces, and they will crawl over jagged glass to cast their vote for the GOP apostate.

I can't stand the Clintons, but Obama makes me queasy, especially in foreign policy.  Never in this century has a party nominated a candidate with a record so thin.  And with foreign policy views so opaque.

- butchie b

May 7, 2008 at 1:39pm

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Anyone know why Mr. Peretz dislikes Hillary Clinton to this extent? He mentioned something about Hillary snubbing him at the White House after The New Republic printed an article critical of the Clinton health plan. Sorry I don't buy Bill Clinton's support of the  Oslo peace process as the reason. Nor, do I think of sexism as the reason either, in Mr. Peretz's case.

- Mahler48

May 7, 2008 at 1:45pm

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Someone over at Salon referred to him as Grandpa Simpson. The image delights me, I will be referring to him as Grandpa Simpson from now on.

- ReganaD

May 7, 2008 at 2:22pm

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butchie,

thin record?  Does the name George W. Bush ring any bells?

- thejauntyboulevardier

May 7, 2008 at 2:29pm

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Mahler48, mu guess is the snub as well as his view that some of Clinton's supporters are untrusworthy.

On the issue of supporters I agree with sleepy Obama's are much more problematic than are Hillary's.

- jacksondyer

May 7, 2008 at 2:32pm

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This constant criticism of Chappaqua has got to stop. It has a little candy store, "Penny Auntie," that's been selling treats to children for over thirty years; the pizza joint next to it is almost that old. Admittedly the place is overrun with deer, the over-entitled, and my ex-wife, but it needn't be slandered.

BTW: Isn't this board supposed to be vetted? How is the vulgarity getting in? If you can't insult someone subtly enough that they don't realize they've been insulted for a few minutes you shouldn't insult them at all.

- AlanK

May 7, 2008 at 2:59pm

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Sorry, cookie.  In the last few decades, we've elected governors on a regular basis.  W was elected twice, first beating an incumbent, Ann Richards, then winning 69% of the vote the second time.  And TX is a big state, even though the governor's post does not have great power there.  At least he has been an executive, like Carter, Reagan, and Clinton.

OTOH, Obama was elected to the state senate 2 or 3 times, got hammered when he ran against Bobby Rush for Congress, then won his Senate seat when his Dem rival got bounced before the race, and Jack Ryan was outed as a sex maniac (with his wife!), and he ran in a blue state against Alan Keyes!!!  IOW, Obama has never had a hard race in his political life.

Again, we have not nominated anyone with no executive experience whatever, and less than one term in the Senate, well, certainly in my lifetime.  Ike is an exception, and we all know why.

His record is thin.

- butchie b

May 7, 2008 at 3:43pm

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Butchie b: Very well said. I have been constantly pointing to Obama's inexperience but this issue is drowned out by his lofty rhetoric. A rhetorician does not necessarily make for a good executive.

- liberal reformer

May 7, 2008 at 4:06pm

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Butch,

Points well taken. On experience, you are right. On being the right person for the time, I still think will throw my lot with Barack. And, as you know, I would also throw my lot in with Hillary too.

- thejauntyboulevardier

May 7, 2008 at 4:21pm

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Fair enough, jauntster.  If he becomes President, I greatly hope you are right.  Because he will be my President, too.

Yes, lib, the man can certainly give a speech.  However, he has said things in his speeches that give one pause.  In the recent free-trade bashing that the Dem candidates did (and will do) Sen. Obama seemed to say that as President, he would revisit MFN status for China.  This would be a major change in US trade and foreign policy.  Did he really mean it?  Hard to tell, because I have no sense of his worldview, at least not yet.  But that is what GE campaigns/debates are for, I suppose.

- butchie b

May 7, 2008 at 5:04pm

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I guess I should provide my own translation. What I meant to say was, "Don't waste your strength on trivial things." I guess I got the point across.

- rozenson

May 7, 2008 at 5:08pm

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butchie, this is why for me it is almost a no lose election no matter who wins. If Obama wins he will be constrained by budget realities but at least can project an optimistic outlook, and I will be honest, it will be a treat to see the American flags come out again whenever he goes abroad. To deny that pride in this symbolism of America as the beacon of the world again is almost unpatriotic. But McCain is a steadier hand who I agree with on Iraq, and a host of his previous domestic priorities (McCain Feingold, McCain Kennedy) Never forget John Kerry asked him to be his VP.

To be honest, I am almost stunned that the Republicans have nominated someone I truly like. And with a heavily Dem. congress he is going to drive the radical right nuts because I truly believe he will govern from the center.  

- blackton

May 7, 2008 at 5:39pm

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Did you all hear Arianna Huffington is sharing a cocktail party exchange  with McCain in which he confided to her that neither he nor Cindy had voted for Bush?

So much for the McBush slur. His disloyalty to the GOP might hurt McCain with Christian conservativies, but  centrist Democrats love his moxy.

- dkrieger

May 7, 2008 at 5:48pm

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Hey, Jack-ass-sondyer

REAL JEWS support Barack Obama, unlike some of the posturing pseudo sons of Abraham who inhabit this blog.

Obama Beats McCain Among Jewish Voters

www.gallup.com/.../Obama-Beats-McCain-Among-Jewish-Voters.aspx

If you're a real Jew, prove it by posting the Ve' ahavta from memory in Hebrew, and then recite three passages of Hoff Tora in ascending order backwards without using a finger pointer, otherwise we'll know you're just one of those covetous uncircumcised goyim pretending to be a Jew on the Internet.

PS Bite my shiny metal ass.  :-)

- AaronBBrown

May 7, 2008 at 7:36pm

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"Bite my shiny metal ass."  AaronBBrown

hey prevert, I don't bite asses. I let my dogs do that.

"REAL JEWS support Barack Obama, unlike some of the posturing pseudo sons of Abraham who inhabit this blog."

Real Jews don't use phrases like "sons of Abraham," jerk.

Jews will vote for McCain in great numbers come November if Obama is the nominee.  Just as they voted for Reagan in 1980.

Now, go fuck yourself!

- jacksondyer

May 7, 2008 at 7:47pm

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Sleepy, I will wager you a hundred bucks--to go to the charity of the winner's choice--that none of the people you mentioned will make it into his cabinet or elsewhere.   Let's put our money where our mouths are.  And by the way, I'd take a left wing nut over a right wing nut any day of the week.  The only interest in me that Mr. Righty has is my eventual disintegration--you know, because, like, when the rapture happens?

The left wing is not that intent on my annihilation.  And please, Mr. Sleepy, don't come back at me that the Left wants to put me into a concentration camp.  Maybe they don't believe in the state of Israel, but they have very little sway in our majority.  The majority of the members of our tribe will stay hard-core Democrat.  In several states, Obama beat Hill in this niche.  Plus, you don't think anti-Semites  exist on the other side?  Ever heard some of the rhetoric from those monkey pastors?  Scary stuff about how we're a bunch of swindling money lenders.  Oh, yeah, and how gays caused Katrina and 9/11.   Look up Hagee, a lovely McCain supporter.  The man has way more crap on his side, trust me, and not just the God squad.  By the way, speaking of usury, where are my three pieces of gold? Oh, yeah--I gave it to the Bolsheviks.  

Aaron Brown:  You're crazy, man.  I mean, you almost make me embarrassed to be an Obama supporter.  Luckily, every other Barack-er I know is sane, well-educated, and just plain civil in their comportment.  

And finally, to you Mr. Krieger: Vis a Vis his no-Bush vote,  McCain is denying, denying, denying.  I'm guessing he did say it, but that's he's an A-1 weasel.  

- MOLLYSIMON

May 7, 2008 at 8:40pm

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"Jews will vote for McCain in great numbers come November if Obama is the nominee.  Just as they voted for Reagan in 1980."  Where's your proof, Mr. Go-Fuck-Yourself?   Oh, sorry, you can't answer that.  We're no longer speaking.  In fact, I can't believe I just posted a message to you.   Is there any way you can delete my posts from your screen?  That way I don't have to quiver for fear of offending you.  

- MOLLYSIMON

May 7, 2008 at 8:48pm

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"Just as they voted for Reagan in 1980."

Liar. According to Jewish Virtual Library, the breakdown was as follows:

Reagan - 39%

Carter - 45%

Anderson - 14%

No Republican has gained a plurality of Jewish votes since 1920, when Socialist Eugene Debs collected 38%.

- rozenson

May 7, 2008 at 10:06pm

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Eat it, Jackson:

www.gallup.com/.../Obama-Beats-McCain-Among-Jewish-Voters.aspx

Title: OBAMA BEATS MCCAIN AMONG JEWISH VOTERS

- rozenson

May 7, 2008 at 10:20pm

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Rozenson, you too are turning into an Obama zombie.

Liar yourself rozenson! Learn to read. I said:

"Jews will vote for McCain in great numbers come November if Obama is the nominee.  Just as they voted for Reagan in 1980."

The numbers you provide is what I am talking about:

“According to Jewish Virtual Library, the breakdown  was as follows:

Reagan - 39%

Carter - 45%

Anderson - 14%”

This was enough to cost Carter the election. Carter himself has been blaming Jews for his loss against Reagan.

I expect that McCain will receive even more votes than that in November. It's a prediction so we'll have to wait till then to see if I am right.  

Notice also that Hillary is getting more of the Jewish vote than McCain.

I also expect that if Hillary doesn't get the nomination many Jewish respondents will switch to McCain.

In any case, McCain is starting with much more support than Reagan had in the early stages of his campaign.

There were many stories spread in the Jewish community about Reagan's supposed antisemitism. Hence it came as a shock to me that so many Jews had voted for him.

- jacksondyer

May 8, 2008 at 12:16am

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Sorry, Jackson -- I guess I read what I wanted to. Not that I'm agreeing with the rest of what you said!

"This was enough to cost Carter the election. Carter himself has been blaming Jews for his loss against Reagan."

And you're going to take Carter's comments on Jews at his word? I think there's a much bigger culprit for his big loss: Reagan Election Committee Chairman Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini.

"Notice also that Hillary is getting more of the Jewish vote than McCain."

Almost within the margin of error. Not enough to change 99 out of 100 elections. And that 1outlier already happened in 2000. Therefore it can't happen again. (Crosses fingers.)

I find it hard to believe that a great deal of Jews would cross over. McCain is certainly perceived as more pro-Israel than Obama, but I saw an AJC poll from this year that said that only 6% of American Jews saw Israel as the top priority for electing a president. And I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that a majority of these people are more hawkish and would support Republicans over Democrats by and large.

- rozenson

May 8, 2008 at 1:22am

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Molly, Communists are as bad as Nazis or Islamists. Not coincidentally these people are often allied. One fine example is Noam Chomsky, who supported a Holocaust denier and is a crazy Communist. And don't tell me Communists aren't bad - I know it first-hand.

And yes, I am more worried by Communists and Islamists than by Nazis. This is because Nazis are marginalized in the US. The other two categories are not and are thus not dangerous.

Moreover, you may afford to not care if Israel is destroyed, as much of the demented far-Left wants, but I care. It is my Israeli passport that allows me to walk freely, knowing  that somewhere in Israel a soldier patrols the frontier of the country. That country is my rock and stands between me and Auschwitz. No amount of persuasion will persuade me of the contrary. I have seen hatred, murder, anti-Semitism. No one can make me believe that a new Auschwitz is not possible (although now it would be called some Arab or Iranian name) - we live in a world that has genocides pretty frequently: Rwanda 1994, Darfur now, etc. Only the State of Israel can prevent an anti-Jewish genocide. Nothing else is good enough.

- sleepyavl

May 8, 2008 at 3:43am

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Call it class warfare, call it what you like, but the growing gulf between rich and poor, the continuing fading of middle-class affluence, and the utter disregard of the GOP for the needs of the poor (e.g., neglect of schools and our healthcare system), will make domestic policy far more important in the general election than foreign policy.

McBush has been a Republican all of his life, married to a very rich woman who he left his wife and family for, a man who knows nothing about economics, a man obsessed with the military (e.g., he has disdain for politicians and the art of politics, and genuine admiration and affection for men in uniforms)...he is the wrong man with the wrong temperament with the wrong background for the problems we face.

- fougasseu

May 8, 2008 at 6:05am

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Obama's impatience with DC - and his refusal to wait around and turn in to a mealy-mouthed, bought and paid for cowardly dinosaur like the rest of the Democrats (if I'd have to listen to Diane Fienstein's spineless butt-kissery for one more second, I'd run too) is his best attribute.  

I feel sort of bad for McCain - I want him to lose and I'm certain he will - but he's barely making sense, let alone mounting a real campaign.  He's a great man and I wish him the best.  I don't agree with him on anything, but I do wish he'd at least not make me feel sorry for him!

- Wandreycer1

May 8, 2008 at 6:27am

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Sleepyavl : You live in a sort of paranoid cosmos. Communism is dead, haven't you heard? Professors of literature who wield their copies of Derrida as weapons of subversion are not new Leninist fifth columnists. The only red outliers in the world are Cuba, where Fidel recently passed the baton to brother Raul, who is trying to keep a pathetically leaky boat afloat and North Korea, under the dotty Kim Jong Il. The gangsta apparatchiks who rule China have long been on the capitalist road and are on the knife's edge of modernity and the bite back effects of a brittle authoritarian poliitical system. Vietnam has been following suit for quite some time now. Islamism is marganilized in the US precisely because we have done a good job of integrating Muslims into the economy, polity and culture. Noam Chomsky is no Communist, he is a black flag anarchist, a partisan of Bakunin and someone who dislikes Marx. All of his books were under a ban in the former Soviet Union, even his linguistic works. Chomsky defended Robert Faurisson on free speech grounds - though he did make an impolitic statement about Faurisson's putative apolitical liberalism - because he is a radical free speecher.

- liberal reformer

May 8, 2008 at 6:56am

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rozenson, wait till November.

The rest is speculation.

- jacksondyer

May 8, 2008 at 9:40am

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"And yes, I am more worried by Communists and Islamists than by Nazis. This is because Nazis are marginalized in the US. The other two categories are not and are thus not dangerous."

I am not worried about none of the extremist groups. The Islamicists do pose a challenge which I think that either Hillary or McCain are better equipped to handle.

McCain isn’t senile Wendy all his misstatements where made on the campaign trail while working crowds for 12 hours or more a day. I’d like to know how alert you would be after 10 hours of campaigning. Obama hasn’t done very well on his feet either after long campaign hours and he is half as old as McCain. (What’s his excuse? Premature senility?)  

I am more worried about slow social disintegration and mis-governance of which we have had too much already.

I don’t believe Obama offers anything new or different. Identifying a problem is not the same as fixing it. Moreover in politics among people who identify themselves as progressives because they don’t want to detail their program they scream instead about change.  This gives them plausible deniability.

The right on the other hand is content to accuse the other side of being communists (liberal in their parlance.)

A McCain victory at least will pull the Republican Party back to the center which is what his right wing detractors are afraid of and many would rather see him lose.

- jacksondyer

May 8, 2008 at 9:56am

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"And yes, I am more worried by Communists and Islamists than by Nazis. This is because Nazis are marginalized in the US. The other two categories are not and are thus not dangerous."  Sleepy

I am not worried about none of the extremist groups. The Islamicists do pose a challenge which I think that either Hillary or McCain are better equipped to handle.

McCain isn’t senile Wendy all his misstatements where made on the campaign trail while working crowds for 12 hours or more a day. I’d like to know how alert you would be after 10 hours of campaigning. Obama hasn’t done very well on his feet either after long campaign hours and he is half as old as McCain. (What’s his excuse? Premature senility?)  

I am more worried about slow social disintegration and mis-governance of which we have had too much already.

I don’t believe Obama offers anything new or different. Identifying a problem is not the same as fixing it. Moreover in politics among people who identify themselves as progressives because they don’t want to detail their program they scream instead about change.  This gives them plausible deniability.

The right on the other hand is content to accuse the other side of being communists (liberal in their parlance.)

A McCain victory at least will pull the Republican Party back to the center which is what his right wing detractors are afraid of and many would rather see him lose.

- jacksondyer

May 8, 2008 at 9:57am

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Jackson, a McCain victory will give him a great opportunity to triangulate, a la Clinton, and not incidentally get a lot done for the country.  He will have a Dem Congress with which he can  work, and a more conservative GOP minority there, which he can sometimes ignore.

Bill did pretty well with that set-up, in domestic affairs anyhow, and I suspect McCain can and will, too.

The gravamen of teh GOP will stay to the Right, however.

- butchie b

May 8, 2008 at 11:00am

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butchie b said: "Jackson, a McCain victory will give him a great opportunity to triangulate, a la Clinton, and not incidentally get a lot done for the country.  He will have a Dem Congress with which he can work, and a more conservative GOP minority there, which he can sometimes ignore."

Probably true as many Democrats who are thinking of voting for McCain will also vote for the Democrats in the Congressional races.

- jacksondyer

May 8, 2008 at 11:43am

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Kudos to you , jacksondyer: Obama doesn't really offer anything different but this large truth is swamped by the mass phenomenon known as Obamaphilia. The only thing different that he offers us is his rhetoric, which of course is not at all substantive.

- liberal reformer

May 8, 2008 at 2:35pm

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JacksonD usually displays some intelligence in his thinking.  But he's being utterly naive if he think McCain will veer to the middle of the road.  His record is extremely conservative; he will keep us in Iraq; and likely appoint more Scalias to the Supreme Court.  

I think I"m getting the hang of not directly addressing Jackson.   Hmm, it's not so hard.  In fact it's kind of nice.

- MOLLYSIMON

May 8, 2008 at 3:23pm

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Hate to break this to you, molly, but staying in Iraq IS the middle of the road.  Neither HRC nor BHO have committed to a total pullout.  No, not even the Chosen One - he hedges his bets, like he's a (gasp!) ambitious pol.

McCain will appoint more Roberts and Alitos - considering Roberts got 78 votes, that's pretty middle of the road.

But McCain is not and has never been a social conservative.  Few career military are (I speak from experience).  So while he may agree with the Right on social issues, he won't actually put them high on the agenda.  Actually, McCain is about as good a GOP candidate as we could have.

- butchie b

May 8, 2008 at 3:43pm

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"Monkey pastors"? That's disgusting. I'm not going to read this blog any more. You should be ashamed.

- jblum8156

May 8, 2008 at 4:18pm

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"The only thing different that he offers us is his rhetoric, which of course is not at all substantive."  LR

Yes, nor original.

- jacksondyer

May 8, 2008 at 6:14pm

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Butchie, Butchie, Butchi, Obama has come out and said we should reposition our troops in Iraq's pro-U.S.  Kurdish North.  Nobody thinks it'll be a sudden coitus interruptus.  Obama's too good a lover for that!

- MOLLYSIMON

May 8, 2008 at 9:05pm

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liberal reformer, you fall for Chomsky's lies? The man lies to you if he says good night - you should assume it's not night. He defended the genocide in Cambodia and he said the research of Faurisson is legitimate. Indeed, Faurisson and Chomsky have something in common: they both deny the value of the testimony of survivors, who are biased.

As for Communism, it's only sorta dead, OK? North Korea is nothing to sneeze at. They have atomic weapons and extermination camps.

As for Communists themselves, they have happily migrated to Islamism. Those cute professors of yours don't just read Derrida, they start boycotts against Jews and indoctrinate college students. What the Nazis were in the 30s, Islamists are now. Some of the Islamists are former Communists - think Roger Garaudy and his ilk. As for Chomsky, he'll support anyone who commits genocide. Incidentally, have you read Bakunin? You should. Bakunin was no blood-crazed shit, like Chomsky is.

And spare me the paranoid bit, OK? I read what Hamas, Hezbollah and various Al-Qaeda groups write - themselves, on their websites. Not sanitized versions by journalists who would then say, as they said after the Holocaust, "but we didn't think they meant it". Well, Hamas and the others want the elimination of Israel and the extermination of every Jew. Without Israel, what would the world do? What it did the last time when the Jews was slaughtered, what it did in Rwanda. Oh yeah, and they'd have a new Schindler List - great movie opportunity. And CNN reporting from Auschwitz: "Calls to Rudolf Hoess, the commander of the camp, were not immediately returned".

- sleepyavl

May 9, 2008 at 10:00am

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Sleepavl: I don't accept anyone's "lies". I check things out for myself. Years ago, I read more on Chomsky on Cambodia and on the Faurisson affair than I now care to remember, more, I would warrant than you ever have. Chomsky never defended the genocide in Cambodia. What actually happened was that he was sceptical of the accounts that were being disseminated in the early years, i.e., 1975 , 1976, in there. Chomsky suspected that such accounts were being manipulated for ideological reasons. I don't know if you are aware of the fact but the US government was less than truthful in many of its statements on the Vietnam war (cf. the Tonkin Gulf affair). This is where Chomsky's blind spot came in - he disbelieved refugee accounts initially. These horrific tales so resembled something that he thought US intel might confect that he tended not to give them credence. By 1977, he was aware that mass killings were taking place in Khmerland. After that, Chomsky had a vested interest in keeping the numbers down. He touted Michael Vickery's work; Vickery maintained, as I recall, that there were some 700,000 deaths caused by Pol Pot and his minions through execution and policies that resulted in starvation, etc. Others had vested interestss in bumping up the numbers. I have seen claims that two, or even three million people were victims of the Khmer Rouge. My position on this is that we will never know with certitude. What we do know with perfect confidence is that, between 1975 and early 1979, at the time of the overthrow of that ghastly regime by the Vietnamese, there was an auto genocide in which huge numbers of people died.

On my lampooning you for your seeing Communists everywhere, all you can manage in your weak reply is that North Korea exists and is dangerous. Well, yes, but that is a little different from the cold war days when there was North Korea and the Soviet Union and North Vietnam (just Vietnam for the last 16 years of the cold war)  and Poland and the Chicoms (Pentagon Paperspeak), ad infinitum. North Korea is on a short leash and knows it; it exists on the subventions of China and if the Chinese pulled the plug, NK would go down the drain.

Your attempted refutation of my denomination of you as having a paranoid worldview by citing Hamas and Hezbollah is hilarious. I am unable to tell if people's misreadings are intentional or not. I was sending up your hermetically sealed worldview based upon your own statements. Long after the cold war, you persist in seeing Communists everywhere. You see radical Islamists everywhere, even where they are not. You construct absurd analogies, such as those between the Nazis and radical Islamists, which, unfortunately, puts you in good company in this era of Walker Bush. Our battle against the Salafists is not on the scale of Worls War II. Anyone who maintains otherwise is just delusional. Yes, they are toxic and dangerous but they do not possess - after the overthrow of the Taliban in November of 2001 - even one state. The top terrorist and his surgeon sidekick are on the lam, likely in caves in northwestern Pakistan. Breath easy sleepyavl and repeat after me: the terrorists are not going to get you, the terrorists ....".

- liberal reformer

May 10, 2008 at 9:21am

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